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 how is the 15x15? 
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Posted on: Sun May 25, 2014 7:57 pm




Posts: 490
Location: Ladysmith, BC, Canada
Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 1:37 am
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
I, too, skip the 15x15 as it just takes too much time (for me it is 2 to 3 hours minimum)......therefore would not want the point amount to go up........


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Posted on: Sun May 25, 2014 11:57 pm




Posts: 163
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:51 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
I like the 15x15s so like the idea of a point increase but also agree that weekly is a little too often. I like the no-op twins.


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 8:52 am




Posts: 2194
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:58 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
sjs34 wrote:
I like the 15x15s so like the idea of a point increase but also agree that weekly is a little too often. I like the no-op twins.

I'm not thinking to adjust the points for all the large puzzles:

9x9: stays at 10
10x10: 14 -> 10
12x12: 16 -> 12
15x15: 8 -> 15


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 9:13 am




Posts: 690
Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 6:51 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
pnm wrote:
sjs34 wrote:
I like the 15x15s so like the idea of a point increase but also agree that weekly is a little too often. I like the no-op twins.

I'm not thinking to adjust the points for all the large puzzles:

9x9: stays at 10
10x10: 14 -> 10
12x12: 16 -> 12
15x15: 8 -> 15


Good, it looks more proportional (though 9x9 on tuesdays is a little special and perhaps it would require 12 points :-) :-)).


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 10:04 am




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Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:58 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
Of course I should have created a separate thread "no-op samples" [glare]

Image


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 12:55 pm




Posts: 690
Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 6:51 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
pnm wrote:
Another one, slightly more difficult.

If I do put puzzles like these online, I'll have to think about how to manage having
to enter operators in different places for the left and right puzzle..

Image


In this twin example, the right puzzle can be solved alone (the cooperation of the left puzzle is not required). However, the left puzzle can not be solved alone (two possible solutions appear by permuting numbers).


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 1:00 pm




Posts: 690
Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 6:51 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
pnm wrote:
Of course I should have created a separate thread "no-op samples" [glare]

Image


The 7x7 no-op with zeros is very amused. Something very curious is that even with the twins to get the unicity of the operator in all cages looks very difficult, the operators in a few cages remain undefined (not unique). In this example it's specially curious the case of the cage "0" (right puzzle) in a1-a2-a3-b1 where you can have two different operators even being a large (4-cell) cage.

I can find 4 cages in the left puzzle and 3 cages in the right puzzle where you can use two different operators.


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 1:05 pm




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Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:58 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
clm wrote:
The 7x7 no-op with zeros is very amused. Something very curious is that even with the twins to get the unicity of the operator in all cages looks very difficult, the operators in a few cages remain undefined (not unique). In this example it's specially curious the case of the cage "0" (right puzzle) in a1-a2-a3-b1 where you can have two different operators even being a large (4-cell) cage.

I can find 4 cages in the left puzzle and 3 cages in the right puzzle where you can use two different operators.


Yes, I think this is going to be the "alternate".

In any case with the no-op puzzles the cages can't be too large (usually a way to
make puzzles harder), because then it becomes easier to determine the operation.


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 9:04 pm




Posts: 163
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:51 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
Regarding point changes:
I agree that keeping 9x9 at 10 and decreasing Friday's 10x10 to 10 make sense except I also agree with clm that 10 might be low for the Tuesday 9x9. 12 might be too marked a cut for the 12x12s. Increasing the 15x15 to 15 sounds good. To me the extra 9x9 exponentiation seems worth 10 and the extra 10x10 (which is usually much harder than the Friday 10x10) seems worth 10-12. Overall and over time the weekly point balance seems to be shifting to the advantage of those proficient at timed puzzles (which does not include me).


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Posted on: Mon May 26, 2014 9:22 pm




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Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:58 pm
Post Re: how is the 15x15?
sjs34 wrote:
Overall and over time the weekly point balance seems to be shifting to the advantage of those proficient at timed puzzles (which does not include me).

Just had a brainwave about this [blink] : maybe the timed bonus points should be
awarded weekly...


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